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RSM-Gazza
29-01-2011, 08:48 PM
Yesterday, Hot like everyday
Today Sat 33
Sunday 38
Mon 40
Tues 41
Wed, Cool Change 37

I'm working straight through the whole weekend with several must do commercial clients and into next week with some big jobs on from Sunday through to next Friday.

I've never drank so much chilled water in my life me thinks.
I carry my much treasured 30 yrs old original Malley's steel esking with the metal folding handle on the ute tray with two coke bottles with frozen water in them for ice temp control in the esky for my home made staminade drinks.
But Hey, I still love the job and when one gets home, you really and I mean really feel like your have earnt that cold crownie in the fridge big time.

Don't know how our friends up Townsville way survive daily with their temps and constant humidity. I take my hat of to you all.
:)
We get the occassional random tropical style rain drop due thunderstorm activity in the late arvo and when it does drop some brief rain. Oooohhhh the humidity kills ya.

Mick
29-01-2011, 09:06 PM
If your doing gardening/labouring work and there are no customers around, take a spare t shirt, soak, ring it out and wear it. It will catch any breeze and help keep you cool. It wont look flash but it does work!

Fred's mowing
29-01-2011, 09:27 PM
I agree with Mick except dont worry about other ppl, just do it!
Also a big sombraero:cool:
Cheers Dean.

VJinTownsville
29-01-2011, 09:40 PM
i jump in the pool lol...townsville weather is just damn cruel...when it is not hot and humid it is pouring rivers.

when it is a perfect day for mowing....its ALWAYS on your day off

RSM-Gazza
29-01-2011, 10:01 PM
I do carry a spare shirt to change into after midday, but I dont wet it down.
Always carry the talcum powder in the tool box though.

If I'm within a shang eye shot of home I may come home for a quick swim. But thats really not a good idea as returning to work can become harder to achieve.

Most times and almost every time, I just suck it in and toughen up. Or look at the list of the top ten things I disliked about my last career job that sits in the tool box.
Then you sort of by pass the heat in mind and remain focused on doing a even better job.
Tomorrow is a half kilometer long multi car dealership with plenty of concrete and bitumen around to raise the temp to 45. Plenty of drive way cross overs and a service road to clean.
But I worked to 6pm tonite to take a smaller job of tomorrows 40 deg to enable a shorter day.
I'll be starting as soon as noise pollution laws allow. All's good and and I've a great hat that breathes around the head part with mesh and has a wire perimiter rim.
Nearly lost it today too, as a mini whirly decided to take it for a moment and spit it out over the highway some 150mtrs away. Chased it like a mexican bull was up my ***e. (more water drank afterwards)

I used to holiday on the Gold Coast in late Jan to early Feb and I know how hot/humid/sticky/uncomfortable that gets and I wasn't even working.

ian
29-01-2011, 10:45 PM
garry if your working in industrial/commercial areas i think the noise regs are different to residential and allow you to start earlier

RSM-Gazza
29-01-2011, 11:00 PM
Ian,

Unfortunately the dealership is thin in depth and a very long multi dealership in length.
There are residential folks behind it in a rear street and I must respect them as the dealer would obviously not wish for any conflict. Especially caused by a contractor.
But if it were a commercial type factory only zoned area, yes you would be right to start earlier.

Sheissh if I don't log of here soon it will be a late start??

Grassman177
30-01-2011, 01:03 AM
so i am glad i dont have to deal with the weather you guys are as it sounds more than uncomfortable! does it always get that hot and humid in those areas? i mean this year here in summer it was cruel,(38 C) for a long time without water too, but it is not typical for such a long streak of hot weather. it usually fluctuates some to get relief for a bit before another heat wave.

Bluey
30-01-2011, 07:37 AM
For those really hot days start early and finish early. There is no point in working in 42 degree heat if your going to be buggered for the next day. That is all the more important if your older. If it is really hot here I work until it really starts to heat up then call it quits. They are forecasting 42 here today and tomorrow so we can add an extra 2 degrees on that for where I am at.

Stripes
30-01-2011, 08:30 AM
I think most of the country is sweltering at the moment. Just don't push it too far, it isnt worth it. Clients should understand why we may not be able to get their lawns cut in weather like this.
Sydney's west will be hovering between 37 and 41 for the next 7 days too.

Fred's mowing
30-01-2011, 08:33 AM
Garry,if u have to work in that exetreme heat, I really do suggest u try soaking your shirts, it really works a treat for 20-30mins at a time.
In the hottest part of the day, this can make a substantial difference!
On days over 40, I barely even bother ringing them out.
Cheers Dean.

Andy B
30-01-2011, 09:26 AM
And wet your hat, try airing your feet and changing your socks at lunch time too. Oh and free balling is a must in anything over 30 i reckon. :D

RSM-Gazza
30-01-2011, 06:19 PM
Thanks for the tips all.
Got through the day with ease thanks to heaps of cold water and my trusty brimmed hat along with Casey's top hits from days gone by on the headset.
Finished the job at 1.30pm and felt so good, I then went and mowed a friend's vacant block that I promised too do with the ride on whilst I had it onboard.
Plus attended to a quote and arrived home at 3.00pm.

Then a phone call at 6.15pm tonite (sunday) requesting to quote their overgrown home as they put it. But requested for me to come right now ie 6.30pm.:i dunno::i dunno:- not likely, but tomorrow-yes.
Happens quite a bit calls at 7.00pm or 8.00pm 7 days a week.

Dean, forecast 40 (Mon) 41 (Tues), I will wet the shirt mate, but any dust may stick to me like???

courty
30-01-2011, 06:38 PM
Gazza
I use a product called a "Buff" when its really hot,wear it like a bandana around my neck,just wet it in cold water and you would be surprised at how cool it keeps you,plus it keeps the sun off your neck.
http://www.buff.com.au/products/high-uv-buff/

Bgs
30-01-2011, 06:52 PM
I use the Columbia shirts which are antibacterial and quick dry I take off and run under water after each job and cool down on the way to the next job and start refreshed.

Big Tip i found a week ago take your phone out of your top pocket before running under the tap :thinking

Mick
30-01-2011, 08:50 PM
Gazza
I use a product called a "Buff" when its really hot,wear it like a bandana around my neck,just wet it in cold water and you would be surprised at how cool it keeps you,plus it keeps the sun off your neck.
http://www.buff.com.au/products/high-uv-buff/

Thought I'd give one a go. Just bought one off ebay ($24) , just hope its a real one!
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/New-Buff-headwear-HIGH-UV-COOLMAX-DUNA-18016-/290527777360?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item43a4ce1250#ht_4034wt_907

Christine Wharton
30-01-2011, 10:05 PM
We find keeping hydrated is vital, so we have lots of water available at all times + hydralyte solution on an ad hoc basis. We also try to fit in a siesta in A/c comfort around the peak heat times if possible. My other half strips off his shirt and gives it a chance to dry out at lunchtime or grabs a new one for the afternoon shift; I opt for wearing a singlet which saves the shirt from getting so wringing wet.

Grassman177
31-01-2011, 07:11 AM
Thanks for the tips all.
Got through the day with ease thanks to heaps of cold water and my trusty brimmed hat along with Casey's top hits from days gone by on the headset.
Finished the job at 1.30pm and felt so good, I then went and mowed a friend's vacant block that I promised too do with the ride on whilst I had it onboard.
Plus attended to a quote and arrived home at 3.00pm.

Then a phone call at 6.15pm tonite (sunday) requesting to quote their overgrown home as they put it. But requested for me to come right now ie 6.30pm.:i dunno::i dunno:- not likely, but tomorrow-yes.
Happens quite a bit calls at 7.00pm or 8.00pm 7 days a week.

Dean, forecast 40 (Mon) 41 (Tues), I will wet the shirt mate, but any dust may stick to me like???
would it not be customary to have a second phone line that after a certain time at night goes to voicemail so you can deal with it during work hours? i mean, i do tons of work in evenings, but i dont however answer the business phone(mainly because it is actually at our shop instead of home) after i go home for the day.

i would think one could still operate likea business inside a home and have "work" hours for those reguards.

i dunno, you made it sound pretty bleek if i had to deal with those kind of calls. we get some true emergency calls through my dad though and do follow up on those

administrator
31-01-2011, 07:43 AM
Do not drink to much water drink when your thirsty , think about how much water you drink

http://www.indmowing.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=8720

Andy B
31-01-2011, 08:33 AM
I use the Columbia shirts which are antibacterial and quick dry I take off and run under water after each job and cool down on the way to the next job and start refreshed.

Big Tip i found a week ago take your phone out of your top pocket before running under the tap :thinking

Yeah I want to get something like that for next year. I was looking at 2xu shirts but a bit exxy for now. I do have a 2xu cap which is great with the vents etc.

courty
31-01-2011, 03:39 PM
Yeah I want to get something like that for next year. I was looking at 2xu shirts but a bit exxy for now. I do have a 2xu cap which is great with the vents etc.

Andy
I wear Columbia's as well as King Gee cool tech shirts,The columbia's are definately cooler. I got all of mine when I was working in the tackle trade so they were at the right price.
Try these guys in the U.S(a lot cheaper),I know a few guys who have got gear off them and their customer service is excellent.


http://www.sierratradingpost.com/p/,38643_Columbia-Sportswear-Bonehead-Fishing-Shirt-Long-Sleeve-For-Men.html

Grassman177
31-01-2011, 04:52 PM
i have used sierra trading post years back. always good, but you might be able to find them cheaper yet if you really shop. maybe not

Bluey
31-01-2011, 06:19 PM
I have tried a lot of things over the last couple of years.We were in high vis but I wanted something that was not the same as all the rest so got away from that but then we needed high vis for some jobs we did so we have recently gone back and after much tooing and froing I have settle on the JB Work Wear high vis polo with the moisture wick fabric. I have gone the hi vis yellow with navy blue gussets down the side and a navy blue patch on the arms. We havy navy blue pants as well. Got the business name above the breat pocket and a big one on the back. They look good and not the same as everyone else which is what I wanted and they are great on hot days as the sweat is drawn off and they cool you down really well. Not cheap but well worth the money

RSM-Gazza
31-01-2011, 08:02 PM
would it not be customary to have a second phone line that after a certain time at night goes to voicemail so you can deal with it during work hours? i mean, i do tons of work in evenings, but i dont however answer the business phone(mainly because it is actually at our shop instead of home) after i go home for the day.

i would think one could still operate likea business inside a home and have "work" hours for those reguards.

i dunno, you made it sound pretty bleek if i had to deal with those kind of calls. we get some true emergency calls through my dad though and do follow up on those

Grassman177,

This is my dedicated bus phone, I'm just stumbled by the amount of times it rings. Like today it rang non stop and when I was on it even just for a 2 min answer/pickup, other people were trying to get through and more messages to work through. Amazing, really is, I just have to thank them for the call and say I can't help you this time. (professionally of course)
Actually I do leave most to message bank in the evening and pick it up the next morning. Especially if a beer has been opened in my personal time.
Anyhow back to the forum topic I guess. forecast 41 deg tomorrow or 106 F.

RSM-Gazza
31-01-2011, 08:20 PM
I have tried a lot of things over the last couple of years.We were in high vis but I wanted something that was not the same as all the rest so got away from that but then we needed high vis for some jobs we did so we have recently gone back and after much tooing and froing I have settle on the JB Work Wear high vis polo with the moisture wick fabric. I have gone the hi vis yellow with navy blue gussets down the side and a navy blue patch on the arms. We havy navy blue pants as well. Got the business name above the breat pocket and a big one on the back. They look good and not the same as everyone else which is what I wanted and they are great on hot days as the sweat is drawn off and they cool you down really well. Not cheap but well worth the money

Bluey,
Tried to sent a PM , but your mail box is full.
Thanks,

Bluey
31-01-2011, 08:26 PM
Bugger. Give me 10 to fix it. I hate the limits on the PM box.

Bluey
31-01-2011, 08:29 PM
Ok mate all fixed.

RSM-Gazza
31-01-2011, 08:31 PM
Bugger. Give me 10 to fix it. I hate the limits on the PM box.

Me too and you can't edit after being sent and prior to being accepted by the receiver and you don't know when they have been accepted by the receiver.
Sorry Admin, I feel better now.:)

graeme
01-02-2011, 03:01 PM
I've been getting started really early, trying to get most of it out of the way in the morning, some days it works, some days there is too much and end up working in the afternoon heat. Luckily I have nearly all ride on work so I guess it's not too bad, have to clean out the chaff screens on the radiator about every hour in this hot weather, the grass is starting to dry out and getting quite dusty here.

imoww
01-02-2011, 05:56 PM
What are the OH&S laws for working in the extream heat?
Is there a temp that we should stop?
Today it was 42 in Syd. All im doing is going slow, taking my time and not pushing myself. Drinking heaps of water and keep on drowning my hat with cool water. Seems to work,.
There was a post from Dean not long ago Re: people dying onthe kokoda trail due to dehydration by drinking just water.
Not sure who it was, but someone mentioned what the Fire depts and services drink in the extream heat.
Anyone know?

imoww
01-02-2011, 05:59 PM
What are the OH&S laws for working in the extream heat?
Is there a temp that we should stop?
Today it was 42 in Syd. All im doing is going slow, taking my time and not pushing myself. Drinking heaps of water and keep on drowning my hat with cool water. Seems to work,.
There was a post from Dean not long ago Re: people dying onthe kokoda trail due to dehydration by drinking just water.
Not sure who it was, but someone mentioned what the Fire depts and services drink in the extream heat.
Anyone know?

it must be the heat getting to me. I just found the post from Dean and the other posts on hydration

Bluey
01-02-2011, 06:10 PM
What are the OH&S laws for working in the extream heat?
Is there a temp that we should stop?


Why worry about OHS laws. OHS laws are in place to stop bosses working people in unsafe conditions. Your the boss and you call the shots so if you work yourself in unsafe conditions who is to blame. The temp you should stop is when you don't feel comfortable to work anymore. As I have said before why push yourself in 40 degree temps. Pace yourself and knock off before you give yourself heat stroke or worse. The work can wait to tomorrow.

Stripes
01-02-2011, 06:38 PM
http://www.workershealth.com.au/facts003.html

There's a bit of info there. Basically there is no set temp workers should stop, but just guidelines about breaks during heat.

I finished at 12 today when the temp was 38, and even from that I was cramping pretty bad for a while after I stopped. I drank about 2 litres during the time I worked and had 3 glasses of Gatorade when I got home. Finally stopped cramping at about 2. Have been sipping water regularly since then. Another 3 days at least of this.

imoww
01-02-2011, 07:01 PM
Cool Stripes.
Im doing a front corner block lawn up your way tomorrow. It will be the 3rd one for the day and Ill be calling it quits.
Not going mad in this heat.
Ive been using the powered Gatorade to get me through the day. it stops the cramping etc.
But gives you lots of pimples... Even at 48 years old.

imoww
01-02-2011, 07:03 PM
Why worry about OHS laws. OHS laws are in place to stop bosses working people in unsafe conditions. Your the boss and you call the shots so if you work yourself in unsafe conditions who is to blame. The temp you should stop is when you don't feel comfortable to work anymore. As I have said before why push yourself in 40 degree temps. Pace yourself and knock off before you give yourself heat stroke or worse. The work can wait to tomorrow.


I was just after a basic guide for when to stop in case im going too far and i dont realise it...

Stripes
01-02-2011, 07:24 PM
Cool Stripes.
Im doing a front corner block lawn up your way tomorrow. It will be the 3rd one for the day and Ill be calling it quits.
Not going mad in this heat.
Ive been using the powered Gatorade to get me through the day. it stops the cramping etc.
But gives you lots of pimples... Even at 48 years old.

Earlier in the week Wednesday was supposed to be 34 instead of the 40 ish temps for the rest of the week, so I booked in heaps of work for Wednesday. Now it is going to be 38 :doh. I have to go to Coogee at 6.30 in the morning, quote at Meadowbank at 8.30, gardening at Castle Hill, then irrigation at Dural. At least the last irrigation job I can let the spray from the sprinklers cool me down.
If you are around my way and you feel like a break/chat/beer/gatorade/swim, give me a buzz and I'll see if I'm around. If it gets too hot I will brush the gardening job. :russ:

Bluey
01-02-2011, 08:27 PM
I was just after a basic guide for when to stop in case im going too far and i dont realise it...

Ok mate fair enough I wasn't having a shot. Just trying to get across the fact that we all should not push ourselves and we should work to the level that suits ourselves. Sorry it might have come across that way.

fairdinkum
02-02-2011, 04:00 AM
I knocked off at 11 yesterday and only have work booked until 12 today. No use pushing myself too hard. This extreme heat is gonna slow the growth for a while anyway. I have already had 2 of my fortnightlies put me off for a week because it hasn't grown. SO the way I see it is that even if I miss a few jobs, I'm not gonna be falling too far behind.

RSM-Gazza
03-02-2011, 07:57 PM
Max today was 38
Humidity was 91-92% amongst sprinkle droplets of rain in the late arvo thanks to those humid thundery clouds developing. Together with the rain from last night.
Had a hand towel around me neck to assit with clearing vision during sweat removal stops.
Only did the one job starting at 2.00 -5.30pm as I had a dental appoint first up, followed by my MYOB book keeper checking my BAS prep.
It was a hard slug doing the one arvo job, but a happy one!!!

This, I've said before. I take my hat off to our fellow mates up the Nth Coast of au, say from Ballina up, that do it in even harder conditions at this time of the year with Mega Humidity.

Edit: I'm rather close to my Dental Surgeon and today he told me some negatives our job position has on our dental well being that needs to be factored into our dental care.
Especially in summer.
When I get time I may post it in the OH&S forum.

Fred's mowing
03-02-2011, 08:52 PM
Max today was 38
Humidity was 91-92% amongst sprinkle droplets of rain in the late arvo thanks to those humid thundery clouds developing. Together with the rain from last night.
Had a hand towel around me neck to assit with clearing vision during sweat removal stops.
Only did the one job starting at 2.00 -5.30pm as I had a dental appoint first up, followed by my MYOB book keeper checking my BAS prep.
It was a hard slug doing the one arvo job, but a happy one!!!

This, I've said before. I take my hat off to our fellow mates up the Nth Coast of au, say from Ballina up, that do it in even harder conditions at this time of the year with Mega Humidity.

Edit: I'm rather close to my Dental Surgeon and today he told me some negatives our job position has on our dental well being that needs to be factored into our dental care.
Especially in summer.
When I get time I may post it in the OH&S forum.

Ya spose to mow the grass Garry, not eat it:smileydevil.
Cheers Fred.

geoff
03-02-2011, 08:55 PM
now dean where the F did u come up with freds mowing , now i know you love fred at the tip but this is going to far lol whoops i meant to pm this one hehehe

Fred's mowing
03-02-2011, 09:06 PM
4 mins & my cover is blown:flush
Thought Id keep it simple, it was either Fred's or Jim's:eek:
Cheers Fred.

geoff
03-02-2011, 09:07 PM
4 mins & my cover is blown:flush
Thought Id keep it simple, it was either Fred's or Jim's:eek:
Cheers Fred.

now freds mowing mate that will catch on ..aussie name the oldies will love ya , if already they dont:david

administrator
03-02-2011, 09:37 PM
Better hope The real Freds Mowing doesnt get upset :smileydevil

imoww
05-02-2011, 06:40 PM
Ok mate fair enough I wasn't having a shot. Just trying to get across the fact that we all should not push ourselves and we should work to the level that suits ourselves. Sorry it might have come across that way.

No worries Bluey. I didnt take it in a bad way brother.

imoww
05-02-2011, 06:47 PM
now freds mowing mate that will catch on ..aussie name the oldies will love ya , if already they dont:david

We better whatch out that Fred's Mowing is not the next Jim's

kevtan
05-02-2011, 07:35 PM
did 10 jobs on the Goldie today...not sure of the temp , but is was f....cken hot
one client put a beer in the freezer for me , so I had to be polite and have a beer with him. Going forward he has banned me from mowing between 12 and 2 as he feels guilty !!!!!

courty
05-02-2011, 07:58 PM
10 on a saturday Kev,your keen mate.

Fred's mowing
05-02-2011, 08:05 PM
did 10 jobs on the Goldie today...not sure of the temp , but is was f....cken hot
one client put a beer in the freezer for me , so I had to be polite and have a beer with him. Going forward he has banned me from mowing between 12 and 2 as he feels guilty !!!!!
I take it he's only joking?
If its not agreeable to u I would'nt allow it.
Your the one thats running YOUR business.
Imagine if all your customers dictated the terms re your schedule
:flush
Cheers Fred.

kevtan
06-02-2011, 06:54 AM
not a regular occurence and won't be either....but I had Monday to Friday off so needed to play a bit of catch up !!!!!

Kathryn
10-01-2013, 10:34 AM
I read the other day that once your heart rate is up and you are sweating any fluids you drink will be used to regulate your bodies temperature. This means that all the water we drink when mowing helps us to cool, but it doesnt get a chance to rehydrate us.
So maybe we should remember to add some glasses of water inbetween knock of beers

Kathryn
10-01-2013, 10:38 AM
P.s. Writing this whilst having a heat break. 2 more mows to go:(

PaulG
10-01-2013, 08:36 PM
I read the other day that once your heart rate is up and you are sweating any fluids you drink will be used to regulate your bodies temperature. This means that all the water we drink when mowing helps us to cool, but it doesnt get a chance to rehydrate us.
So maybe we should remember to add some glasses of water inbetween knock of beers

Absolutely correct. I was working at the nursery today, just walking around doing retail-nursery stuff, and I still went through 3.5 litres of water from 9.15 to 4.30pm. That was 34 degrees at the hottest time today.

When you are sweating that much and more you need to to take either salt tablets or a proper electrolyte-replacement drink. Not Powerade etc, made by Coca Cola as the major ingredient is sugar, not potassium and magnesium which is what you need when you are dehydrated.

ian
10-01-2013, 09:13 PM
salt tablets can actually dehydrate your body as the body draws water away from other areas to deal with the excess salt in your stomach
Treating dehydration in athletes of all ages
For exercise-related dehydration, cool water is your best bet. Sports drinks containing electrolytes and a carbohydrate solution also may be helpful. There's no need for salt tablets — too much salt can lead to hypernatremic dehydration, a condition in which your body not only is short of water but also carries an excess of sodium.

PaulG
10-01-2013, 10:19 PM
A couple of salt tablets in a day (which is all I ever take - and only if cramping of the leg muscles starts) won't cause excess dehydration. Especially in conjunction with the amount of water we would consume per day in Summer.

Too much water alone can actually flush much needed salts and electrolytes from your body and severely affect your blood-plasma. I've studied exercise-physiology in-depth at Uni years ago and have a fairly good handle on this topic especially as it relates to me personally, having to balance my intake and output regarding the Crohn's Disease and the short-bowel I've been left with as a result of resection-surgery.

Everything in moderation, and salt-tablets are only a last resort for me when muscle cramps start. After taking two salt tablets, cramping subsides within about 20 minutes.

Lawn Mowing Professionals
10-01-2013, 10:47 PM
salt tablets can actually dehydrate your body as the body draws water away from other areas to deal with the excess salt in your stomach
Treating dehydration in athletes of all ages
For exercise-related dehydration, cool water is your best bet. Sports drinks containing electrolytes and a carbohydrate solution also may be helpful. There's no need for salt tablets — too much salt can lead to hypernatremic dehydration, a condition in which your body not only is short of water but also carries an excess of sodium.

+1

instead of cool or cold water though... room temperature is actually better. The colder the water, the more your body needs to consume energy to get the water to your body temerature.

Keep away (as much as possible) from the 5 white poision's for your body... white salt, white sugar, white flour, white rice and white "refined" oils.

It is an interesting topic this one. I have actually got to force myself to drink throughout the day once i become mildly dehyrated...

I agree with this info Paul! (i took out salt tablets as most people consume way to much salt anyways... grab some fries from macca's :laughing:)

"When you are sweating that much and more you need to to take a proper electrolyte-replacement drink. Not Powerade etc, made by Coca Cola as the major ingredient is sugar, not potassium and magnesium which is what you need when you are dehydrated".

Simmo.

Lawn Mowing Professionals
10-01-2013, 11:00 PM
A couple of salt tablets in a day (which is all I ever take - and only if cramping of the leg muscles starts) won't cause excess dehydration. Especially in conjunction with the amount of water we would consume per day in Summer.

Too much water alone can actually flush much needed salts and electrolytes from your body and severely affect your blood-plasma. I've studied exercise-physiology in-depth at Uni years ago and have a fairly good handle on this topic especially as it relates to me personally, having to balance my intake and output regarding the Crohn's Disease and the short-bowel I've been left with as a result of resection-surgery.

Everything in moderation, and salt-tablets are only a last resort for me when muscle cramps start. After taking two salt tablets, cramping subsides within about 20 minutes.

I think the problem is most people don't consume enough water or liquid for that matter... I know i don't.

If i was to have salt tablets or anything high in sodium it actually has a negative on me.

Like you say though... everyone and everybody is different.


Another important one is not to consume caffeine or pain killers prior to working in the heat as this will affect the sodium imbalance. I know that i sometimes do :(


Simmo.

PaulG
10-01-2013, 11:11 PM
This is a good article to read. It is based on data from Hawaiian Ironman athletes which is more extreme then what we do. Athletes are said to sweat between 27 to 41 grams of salt in the 12hours of the race. The salt tabs I take (readily available at Chemists) are 600mg or 0.6grams, or similar to eating about 10 salty pretzels.

Throughout my life I've been on regular doses (and large doses) of non-steroidal anti-inflammatories too (mentioned in this article) which is another reason I take a lot of care with what I use to supplement my diet and in particular, exercise recovery. These salt tablets are just everyday Sodium Chloride (NaCl), just in a different concentration. It's worth reading more about as it's in more everyday foods then you can imagine - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sodium_chloride

http://www.rice.edu/~jenky/sports/salt.html


Salt and the ultraendurance athlete

Recently, Americans have been urged to pay more attention to their sodium intake. Decades ago, all foods seemed heavily salted. Then, a link between sodium intake and high blood pressure was discovered. Suddenly, "sodium - free" or "low sodium" products began flooding the consumer market. Certainly, to a degree, this is justified. Many diseases are worsened by excess sodium intake, and millions of Americans must closely watch the amount of sodium in their diet.

However, sodium is a required element for normal body functions. It is lost in sweat and urine and is replaced in the diet. The body has a remarkable ability to maintain sodium and water balance throughout a variety of conditions, thus ensuring our survival. Ultraendurance events challenge this survival mechanism.

In hot, humid conditions a large amount of sweat is lost, which can disturb sodium and water balance. Adequate hydration and sodium intake -- either via sports drinks or food -- becomes vitally important during long races. The goal of this article is to help you determine how to maintain sodium balance during training and racing and during recovery. The information for this article came from a variety of published studies done on healthy, young athletes and may not be appropriate for everyone. Athletes who are under a physician's care or have health problems should check with their doctor about salt and their ability to exercise in the heat.


Hyponatremia -- what is it?

Hyponatremia means a low concentration of sodium in the blood. When it occurs in triathletes, it usually happens during long or ultra-distance races in the heat but may occur anytime. It is estimated that approximately 30% of the finishers of the Hawaii Ironman are both hyponatremic and dehydrated. The longer the race, the greater the risk of hyponatremia.


What causes it?

The exact mechanisms are not fully understood and I won't go into the complex physiologic pathways of sodium and water balance. The simplest answer is that lost sweat (salt and water) is replaced by ingested water (no salt). This dilutes the sodium in the bloodstream, and hyponatremia results. Longer races carry a greater risk of hyponatremia because of the total amount of sweat lost. During exercise in the heat, more salt is lost in sweat per hour than is usually replaced by food and fluids, including sports drinks. Your body can tolerate a degree of imbalance for a short period of time, but it may decompensate if this continues for too long.

Sweat contains between 2.25 - 3.4 grams of salt per liter, and the rate of perspiration in a long, hot race can easily average 1 liter per hour. So, for a 12 hour race, one could lose approximately 27 to 41 grams of salt. If the athlete replaces only the lost water and has minimal salt intake, hyponatremia can result.


Medications and hyponatremia

Aspirin, ibuprofen, and other non-steroidal anti-inflammatory agents interfere with kidney function and may contribute to the development of hyponatremia in triathletes. The same applies to acetaminophen (Tylenol). I have seen many athletes taking these drugs during Ironman races, and I strongly recommend against this practice. They won't make you faster and may hurt you. Under tough conditions, your kidneys need to function at 100%. Other drugs that may contribute to hyponatremia are diuretics, narcotics, and certain psychiatric medications.


What are the symptoms of hyponatremia?

The spectrum of symptoms can range from mild to severe and can include nausea, muscle cramps, disorientation, slurred speech, confusion, and inappropriate behavior. As it progresses, victims may experience seizures or coma, and death can occur. Severe hyponatremia is a true medical emergency.


Treatment

Minor symptoms, such as nausea and mild muscle cramps, can be treated by eating salty foods and hydrating with a sodium containing sports drink. More severe symptoms require treatment by qualified medical personnel. If you think you are suffering from hyponatremia or are unsure, seek medical attention immediately.


Recommendations

There are no clear cut guidelines, and recommendations need to be individualized for each triathlete. Some authorities recommend drinking less water to rebalance sodium and water intake. However, given the risk of dehydration and heat injury, this is not a practical recommendation. To reiterate, all of the hyponatremic athletes in the Hawaii Ironman were also dehydrated. Others recommend increasing salt intake, and this seems more prudent. By ingesting more sodium, hydration with water is balanced and dilution of blood sodium does not occur.


Relative importance for different length races

length of race less than 1 hr 1 - 3 hrs >3 hrs
water -/+ + +
carbohydrate - + +
salt - -/+ +

It cannot be stressed enough that you have got to know what your needs are prior to race day. Rehearse your hydration, feeding, and salt strategy during your training sessions. There are so many variations between individuals that there is no single right answer. Know what your body's' needs are.

Drink frequently to attempt to stay hydrated.
During a long, hot race, aim for a total sodium intake of approximately 1 gram per hour, as recommended by Doug Hiller, M.D. from experience with the Hawaii Ironman. Please note that this may not be appropriate for everyone.
During training, heat acclimatization, and for several days leading up to a big race make sure that you increase salt intake by 10 - 25 grams per day.
Sodium is also important for recovery. A Texas favorite after a hot training ride, or run, is low-fat tortilla chips (salty ones) and picante sauce (quite salty).
Avoid aspirin, ibuprofen, or other anti-inflammatories, and acetaminophen during exercise, but especially during a race.
Check with your doctor if you have any health problems.


Salt vs. Sodium?

Undoubtedly, some of you have noticed that FDA food labels list grams (or milligrams) of sodium, and at times in this article, I have referred to grams of salt. What is the difference? Salt is made up of sodium and chloride. The FDA labels lists only the sodium content. This is because there are usually other sodium containing salts (eg. sodium citrate) in these products. To avoid confusion, the easiest way to ensure that you have enough sodium intake is to get used to reading the FDA labels. For example to get 1 gram (1000mg) of sodium into your body, you would need to drink more than half a gallon (2.18 liters) of Gatorade -- certainly impractical every hour! To get 1 gram of sodium from table salt, you would need to ingest 2.5 grams (1 gram from sodium, 1.5 grams from chloride). A teaspoon of salt weighs approximately 6.6 grams.


What about salt tablets?

It is best if you strive to get your sodium from both sports drinks and salty foods -- as opposed to salt tablets -- for two reasons. Salty foods stimulate thirst, and it is possible to ingest too much salt with tablets but very difficult with food. If you don't think that your food and sports drink is providing enough sodium, then consider salt tablets. Make sure you know how much you are taking!


What foods are best?

Ideally, foods consumed during a long race should be low fat, low protein, high carbohydrate, and provide a source of sodium. You need water, carbohydrates, and salt to survive a long race. For convenience, I have listed a few foods and sports drinks and their respective sodium content. You'll need to experiment and find the combination that is best for you. Get used to reading the FDA labels.

mg sodium serving fat(g) carbo(g)
protein(g)
Gatorade 110 8 fl.oz 0 14 0
Exceed 50 8 fl. oz 0 17 0

Baked Tostitos 140 1 oz.(13 chips) 1 24 3
SnackWell's
Wheat crackers 170 5 crackers 0 12 2
Sunshine Bavarian
Sourdough pretzels 490 2 pretzels 0 23 3
Baked Rold Gold
pretzels 500 10 pretzels 1 22 3
Baked Rold Gold
Hard Sourdough
pretzels 220 1 pretzel 0 19 2
Premium Fat-free
Saltines 130 5 crackers 0 11 1
Mr. Salty
pretzel twists 550 9 pretzels 0.5 24 333



COPYRIGHT ©1997 SportsMed Web

PaulG
11-01-2013, 12:10 AM
Haven't seen the Thorzt product in shops here yet Christine. Will have to keep an eye out for it. The one I generally use (as the local chemist stocks it) is the Endura brand.

Christine Wharton
11-01-2013, 12:54 AM
We've been going through water like it was as important as the air we breathe lately...it's just so dehyrating your eyes hurt at the end of the day sometimes. In addition to drinking water we supplement some bottles of water with hydralytes - adding a single-serve sachet of sugar-free powder from Squincher/ Thorzt when our bodies are crying out for more than just H20. We've only just found out about the Thorzt and have given it a go (being an Aussie product developed for Aussie conditions); while their sachets make up a bit bigger serve we have found they don't don't dissolve as well, and the clumps of powder make globules which can taste a bit "ick".
Hydralytes are a real must tho' - couldn't survive without them in the heat...and a long siesta in a/c comfort in the peak heat of the day ;)

ian
11-01-2013, 09:09 PM
i add a small amount of salt to my bottles before i freeze them about 1/5 of a teaspoon or less to 1/2 lt water in a 1.5 lt bottle the i fill the bottles with water before leaving put in cooler bag and the ice melts and slowly adds salt through the day

AJD Mowing
12-01-2013, 05:35 AM
If you start getting cramps in your legs in the night it can be caused from lack of salt or magnesium. This is a comon thing among brickies working in the heat. I get customers ask me "Arnt you hot"? But realy lawnmowing is so much better than the building trade, In the building trade you might be stuck in a big hole with no wind and full sun all day or up against a wall with the sun behind and no shade. Lawnmowing your under trees half the time and then your in the car for 5-10

Valley Lawnmowing
12-01-2013, 05:44 AM
I use Endura electrolyte powder and it works really well specialy when ive got 4 hours of brushcutting to do also drink plenty of beer when i get home:p

Cranbourne Lawnmowing
12-01-2013, 03:17 PM
Unless I'm doing ride on work I've made a point of not working after 1pm on days when its over 35 degrees. I've had a few close calls working on hot days. ie: muscle cramps dizzyness and the legs go like jelly, driven through red lights and gone straight through round a bouts without looking right. Once your at that point its not good. I've been lucky so far but decided that no job is worth taking that sort of risk. Shouldn't get to that point of wellbeing before you realize its time to go home.

South East Mowing
12-01-2013, 04:30 PM
Unless I'm doing ride on work I've made a point of not working after 1pm on days when its over 35 degrees. I've had a few close calls working on hot days. ie: muscle cramps dizzyness and the legs go like jelly, driven through red lights and gone straight through round a bouts without looking right. Once your at that point its not good. I've been lucky so far but decided that no job is worth taking that sort of risk. Shouldn't get to that point of wellbeing before you realize its time to go home.

I was told yesterday i was "just an old bastard" for not working. Speaking to the same fella today I told him I was working, it was about 24c and I am "not a silly old bastard":dance

Thats my attitude to working in the heat, get out of it as soon as I can and preferably dont start at all on hot days

fairdinkum
13-01-2013, 06:04 AM
If a super hot day is predicted I work my arse off the day before. At worst I will start before 7am and do a maximum of 3 lawns on the hot day and be home by 9am. But usually I stay home.

sterlo
13-01-2013, 06:48 AM
I was told yesterday i was "just an old bastard" for not working. Speaking to the same fella today I told him I was working, it was about 24c and I am "not a silly old bastard":dance

Thats my attitude to working in the heat, get out of it as soon as I can and preferably dont start at all on hot days

Maybe that fella had better things to do on the weekend and most of next week....like i dunno, kicking back on the beach with the kiddies or something?

Sterlo

BobC
16-01-2013, 08:07 PM
Total fire Ban here tommorow so I've got all tomorrows jobs done today. Not working tomorrow.

My little grandaughter is coming down for the day so it was an easy decision to make!
:cool:

RSM-Gazza
16-01-2013, 08:53 PM
Total fire Ban here tommorow so I've got all tomorrows jobs done today. Not working tomorrow.

My little grandaughter is coming down for the day so it was an easy decision to make!
:cool:

Yep the heat continues inland with 36.5 today, 39 tomorrow and Friday at 40 with some rain (humid) and 37's and a few 38's next week.
Cancelled an all day farm/ranch job tomorrow, will have to do a few jobs on Friday morning before the heat builds up too much. Plus have to work all weekend on my commercial regardless of weather.
Tomorrow will put me ride on on ramps and change blades and grease the spindles and do a maintenance run on it in me shed. Fortunately l air conditioned the shed for watching summer cricket within.
This constant heat takes the wally out of you when you wake up each morning and stagger to the shower. But it's heaps better than a corporate job.

Folks with Silver Birches, Camellia, Azaleas and Pittosporums in there gardens are very heat stressed and dead in nearly gardens I visit.

PaulG
16-01-2013, 11:53 PM
Take care out there everyone.

The following is from a Workplace Health & Safety Queensland email I received yesterday:_


Employers urged to protect workers from heat stress

Following the suspected heat related death of a Queensland worker near Roma last weekend, Workplace Health and Safety Queensland has urged employers to ensure their workers are not exposed to deadly heat stress.

Working in the sun, especially in Queensland, for a long period of time without adequate breaks, shade or water can mean workers face serious dehydration and are at risk of a heat-related illness or even death. Employers must provide protection for their workers from the heat and sun - and workers must follow their employer’s instructions regarding heat stress and sun safety.

In other recent events, a road worker was transported to Toowoomba Base hospital for heat related treatment and the following day a housing construction site worker at Miles received treatment by ambulance officers for heat stress.

Late last year, a 25 year old worker died and his colleague was hospitalised with severe dehydration after walking just 6km in 45 degree heat when they couldn't free their bogged vehicle in the Simpson Desert.

Workers are most at risk during heat waves when temperatures are above the average for three or more days, with high humidity increasing the risk.

Very hot and extreme heat conditions can lead to heat-related health problems such as cramps, exhaustion, heat stroke, and fainting. Employers should weigh up all factors such as heat, humidity, water intake, breezes, protective gear, the physical condition of workers and their hours of work.

The Managing the work environment and facilities code of practice (PDF, 247 kB) provides guidance for managing the risks associated with outdoor work. For more information on protecting your workers this summer, visit www.worksafe.qld.gov.au or call the WHS Infoline on 1300 369 915.

The most important reason for making your
workplace safe, is not work at all

Work Safe. Home safe.

PaulG
16-01-2013, 11:55 PM
Bit more reading if you're keen.


http://www.deir.qld.gov.au/workplace/subjects/sunsafety/index.htm

RSM-Gazza
17-01-2013, 09:17 AM
Interesting read Paul,
Guess we all know how to care for ourselves, but the Macho Man/Lady things sometimes overrides and I'm 100% guilty of it. Especially after New Year's Eve this year working in plus 40 temp's day in day out. There was one day when it was 40 and at midday I rang wife to let her know the address of my worksite as I felt off. Posted such in the forum the other week that I felt crap during the heat one day.

But the muncho man is eating me away again today, as I'm staying home and feel like a woossy/softy for not being out working with so many jobs outstanding and seaming no spare diary slots to accomodate the work load into the next 3 weeks.
9.20am and its 30 already. But I'm working the weekend so I should just treat today as an RDO type thing like you would in a work force type job.

Some days an e-mail like the one you got Paul is needed just to tap us on the shoulder to let the Macho Man Demon know to "P*ss Off" at times.

Edit, Logged into the local Weather Info site again and at 9.30 its 31.5, quite a jump in ten minutes.

Greenie
17-01-2013, 01:00 PM
If a super hot day is predicted I work my arse off the day before. At worst I will start before 7am and do a maximum of 3 lawns on the hot day and be home by 9am. But usually I stay home.

Im the same:) i worked till lunch today canceled the rest:) dsave them for a cooler day. My customers all understand, and most are goodf with it...
the heat is not worth the pain!

BLACK BEAR
17-01-2013, 01:07 PM
Interesting read Paul,
Guess we all know how to care for ourselves, but the Macho Man/Lady things sometimes overrides and I'm 100% guilty of it. Especially after New Year's Eve this year working in plus 40 temp's day in day out. There was one day when it was 40 and at midday I rang wife to let her know the address of my worksite as I felt off. Posted such in the forum the other week that I felt crap during the heat one day.

But the muncho man is eating me away again today, as I'm staying home and feel like a woossy/softy for not being out working with so many jobs outstanding and seaming no spare diary slots to accomodate the work load into the next 3 weeks.
9.20am and its 30 already. But I'm working the weekend so I should just treat today as an RDO type thing like you would in a work force type job.

Some days an e-mail like the one you got Paul is needed just to tap us on the shoulder to let the Macho Man Demon know to "P*ss Off" at times.

Edit, Logged into the local Weather Info site again and at 9.30 its 31.5, quite a jump in ten minutes.

Hey RSM, they say you get a litte smarter with age! That FU*$^N heat has taught me to get real smart real quick.

And another thing - if you don't take care on NO 1, how can you expect others to.

The work will always be there, and if clients don't understand then you probably shouldnt have them as clients. I am sure they will let you know if they have a special occasion and need you soon, otherwise JUMP IN THE POOL:cool:

bb1
17-01-2013, 03:44 PM
The work will always be there, and if clients don't understand then you probably shouldnt have them as clients. I am sure they will let you know if they have a special occasion and need you soon, otherwise JUMP IN THE POOL:cool:

Funny you should say if clients dont understand they probably shouldnt be your clients. I had a client a couple of years back who couldnt understand when I didnt turn up 3 days in a row, the temps were only 38, 43 and 43 (lead up to black saturday). i let her know what was happening, etc. But she just didnt get it. well after that she just wasnt my client anymore, if they think there garden is more important than my health than they get the flick. I found out she was a school teacher, sorry to any school teachers out there but I have had nothing but trouble with them, if they tell me they are school teachers on the initial call, I now just say I am to busy for the next 4 weeks, and that gets rid of them.

RSM-Gazza
17-01-2013, 05:01 PM
Inland heat is a little different to Melb as our heat is everyday through out summer and you kinda have to work through it. Or no income and no customers getting serviced from day to day and week to week.
Today I pulled the pin on work to have a rest from it, but one still has to soldier on in the above 35 heat in general to keep the business going.

Fred touched on it the other week referring to several members who have the constant heat, mentioning something like Melb you roster can around a real hot day, but when it hot everyday you need to work to keep the bills paid and customer work flowing.
Not complaining, just creating discussion re the lovely hotter than usual summer we are having day in day out.

South East Mowing
17-01-2013, 05:17 PM
Funny you should say if clients dont understand they probably shouldnt be your clients. I had a client a couple of years back who couldnt understand when I didnt turn up 3 days in a row, the temps were only 38, 43 and 43 (lead up to black saturday). i let her know what was happening, etc. But she just didnt get it. well after that she just wasnt my client anymore, if they think there garden is more important than my health than they get the flick. I found out she was a school teacher, sorry to any school teachers out there but I have had nothing but trouble with them, if they tell me they are school teachers on the initial call, I now just say I am to busy for the next 4 weeks, and that gets rid of them.

School teacher. Maybe we should start another thread about how us lawnies feel about certain o:laughing:ccupational types

A plumber next to a client I do (often last thing in the day) keeps asking for an occasional mow. I keep making excuses as its often late in the day, but did him once . Anyway yesterday he asked me same thing, 6pm. Sorry mate Im late already and getting up at 5am to start early , gotta get home. He says well how about booking me in on your regualr visit? Sure no probs in 3 weeks. How much he asks? $25 Just nature strip and front leaving clippings in your bin. He says yeah no problem, thats a fair rate of pay you work at - last time it took you less than 15 minutes. I couldnt resist and said, Now you know how we feel when you sting us:) He understood and smiled. As long as you earn a fair quid he says

Fred's mowing
17-01-2013, 05:48 PM
Inland heat is a little different to Melb as our heat is everyday through out summer and you kinda have to work through it. Or no income and no customers getting serviced from day to day and week to week.
Today I pulled the pin on work to have a rest from it, but one still has to soldier on in the above 35 heat in general to keep the business going.

Fred touched on it the other week referring to several members who have the constant heat, mentioning something like Melb you roster can around a real hot day, but when it hot everyday you need to work to keep the bills paid and customer work flowing.
Not complaining, just creating discussion re the lovely hotter than usual summer we are having day in day out.

Worked up till early arvo as scheduled & it was low/mid 30's. It reached 41 but tomorrow will be back in the 20's tomorrow.
Its failey easy for us on the coast, not so much for the inland guys.
Im a true whitey but its not the heat that gets to much,its the suns rays.
Ive worked my whole life outdoors & have'nt been that sunsmart:rolleyes:
Ive been lucky to not have any skin cancers, my offsider just had one cut off his eyelid!
Try not to get sunburnt as in the evening when its alittle cooler, your skins still cookin, making it very uncomfortable.
Obviously there's additional concerns about dehydration, etc.
Im not that big on sunsceen, preferring to cover up with lightish weight clothing.
Cant stand that slimey stuff partic when your sweating & it gets dusty.
As long as your thinking about it doing what u can, she'll be apples!
Hit the coast Gazza!!!!!!!!
Cheers Fred.

Lawn Mowing Professionals
17-01-2013, 06:56 PM
School teacher. Maybe we should start another thread about how us lawnies feel about certain o:laughing:ccupational types

A plumber next to a client I do (often last thing in the day) keeps asking for an occasional mow. I keep making excuses as its often late in the day, but did him once . Anyway yesterday he asked me same thing, 6pm. Sorry mate Im late already and getting up at 5am to start early , gotta get home. He says well how about booking me in on your regualr visit? Sure no probs in 3 weeks. How much he asks? $25 Just nature strip and front leaving clippings in your bin. He says yeah no problem, thats a fair rate of pay you work at - last time it took you less than 15 minutes. I couldnt resist and said, Now you know how we feel when you sting us:) He understood and smiled. As long as you earn a fair quid he says

:laughing:

Simmo.

Chris B
17-01-2013, 08:49 PM
Worked up till early arvo as scheduled & it was low/mid 30's. It reached 41 but tomorrow will be back in the 20's tomorrow.
Its failey easy for us on the coast, not so much for the inland guys.
Im a true whitey but its not the heat that gets to much,its the suns rays.
Ive worked my whole life outdoors & have'nt been that sunsmart:rolleyes:
Ive been lucky to not have any skin cancers, my offsider just had one cut off his eyelid!
Try not to get sunburnt as in the evening when its alittle cooler, your skins still cookin, making it very uncomfortable.
Obviously there's additional concerns about dehydration, etc.
Im not that big on sunsceen, preferring to cover up with lightish weight clothing.
Cant stand that slimey stuff partic when your sweating & it gets dusty.
As long as your thinking about it doing what u can, she'll be apples!
Hit the coast Gazza!!!!!!!!
Cheers Fred.

Funny you mention that... check out what I just bought today.. its about 3 x the price of regular sunscreen but will be worth it5908

Blaktop
17-01-2013, 09:52 PM
Working through summer (summer last from October to mid April up there) with a gang of 6 in Alice Springs (where 35 in summer is considered a cool change) for 4 years has made me a little "meh" when people down here complain about the 32 degree heat. Granted it's more humid than Alice but when it gets to 40 then it's starting to get hot. Before I was doing lawnie work up there I was a tour guide for 7 years. Remember doing 4 five day camping tours in a row where every day was 40 or higher.....in the shade, and we were hiking King's Canyon in the sun, temps up around 55 up the top of the Canyon......drink lots of water and long swims in the Garden of Eden (water hole up the top).

NLALM
18-01-2013, 02:08 PM
Funny you mention that... check out what I just bought today.. its about 3 x the price of regular sunscreen but will be worth it5908

Hey chris where did you get the sunscreen, looks like the go I want some

ian
18-01-2013, 06:39 PM
http://www.chemistwarehouse.com.au/product.asp?id=64354
i think i will look at getting some as well I've hated using most of the one's I've tried

Fred's mowing
18-01-2013, 07:30 PM
Funny you mention that... check out what I just bought today.. its about 3 x the price of regular sunscreen but will be worth it5908

Thanx Chris, u got it, but have u used it?
What's your opinion?
Cheers Fred.

Chris B
19-01-2013, 08:06 AM
It's really good. Much, much better than normal sunscreen. Doesn't leave your skin greasy and shiny like every other one I have tried. I bought it at Coles for around 32 or 33 $... seems to only come in one litre...at least at Coles. I'm not that worried about cancer but I dont want to look like I'm 50 when I turn 30 lol

Fred's mowing
19-01-2013, 09:27 AM
You're so vain............. you proly think this post is about you.:big grin
Cheers Fred.

Chris B
19-01-2013, 12:38 PM
hahaha im not getting a facelift! just dont want to look like a wrinkly old F@#$r any quicker than necessary that's all :)

http://www.se-plasticsurgery.com/general-information/harmful-rays/

it does come in a smaller size at chemist warehouse though... so give it a try!

http://www.chemistwarehouse.com.au/product.asp?id=66814&pname=Cancer+Council+Sunscreen+Finger+Spray+Work+2 00ml